Military Campgroungs Standards

Hello, I have only been camping at Military Camp Grounds for a few years. In that time, I have seen some that are truly outstanding. And, others that are little more than tariler courts. Why is their not a min. standard for all Military Campgrounds? Or a select team from Military camping that meets with the Comander, MWR of each Base and inform them where they stand with other Military Camp Grounds that year. Yes, some comanders, MWR, may not care, but otheres may improve there campgrounds. Like, Ft Jackson SC compaired to Short Stay SC. The same with camp host, some are truly profeshonals others little more than homless vets. Is there not a rating that would let the MWR or comander know they have an outstanding camp host, or one that truily needs to be replaced? And whats up with some states like PA, 1.1 million vets and not one camp ground? Are you telling me there is not money to be made, and NG or AR lands that retire's could use? If we don't work together to make thing better they are not going to get better on ther own.

Welcome aboard CPT Pilon. Your observations of how the military campground system is spot on. As has been previously posted here on Military Campgrounds you are beating a dead horse. Each base/post/station (and by definition – the commander) is responsible for the campground and its operation. There is no uniform “standard” within the military branches, or even within a given branch. You are correct in assuming that MCGs generate income, and is a part of each organization’s value stream. However, within the Non-Appropriated Funds (NAF) organizations, expenditure of funds on campgrounds is driven by return on investment (ROE). Northern tier base campgrounds are open for five to six months, some for less. How many folks are going to southern tier bases in the middle of the summer heat and humidity? Regarding the “trailer camp” appearance of some MCGs, I could not agree more. The following URL will take you to a web site where you can, and should comment of this very subject. - ice.disa.mil
I and many others have used this site with positive results.

Good luck and good camping!

John

Donald:

Hurrah for MCG "Standards."

Granted each CG, their assets and resources are unique but that does not obviate the need for a guide showing what MCG's would look like if they were broken.

I advocate adding MCG's as a rated criteria for the CINC Installation Excellence Awards although I don't know how "we" would do that. Perhaps through the Military Coalition ( www.themilitarycoalition.org ) or the various Retiree Affairs Offices (RAO).

My suggested first step would be an MWR guideline that lists pro's and con's regarding most campground procedures.
Reservations vs no reservations.
Deposits?
Mandatory access/availability (read cell phone w/texting) of camp host either after-hours when MWR is closed or at all times if that's within their "JOB DESCRIPTION"
Length of stay rules!

Although each MCG might write the description to the base commander's liking, I'm sure that civilian personnel manpower specialists could write a job description that would bind a "volunteer" host or paid MWR camp clerk to a measurable standard however the commander chose to implement it!

Not to bore you to tears, but here are some links that coalesce the concept and NEED of a MCG Guide/Checklist for "Commanders" and a need for commanders to set a job description, however he or she (the commander) may choose to structure the description with duty description compiled by his manpower and personnel staff.

References:

Are Military Campground Hosts Homesteaders?
"an excellent start to a suggested "JOB DESCRIPTION" for MCG Host. #6726

"Military Campground Host? Are they needed? that site the host is occupying is lost revenue for the MWR and a lost nights stay for some passer by." #4011

"I saw so many old boy camp hosts, taking up spaces" #4012

"Camp Hosts serve a purpose IF they do the job" #4013

"Unfortunately, there are hosts that either don't do enough, or go overboard." #4015

eventually the voices will be heard and action will be taken to assure everyone access to the MCG on an equal basis, .. and more good hosts than bad #4016

performing Camp Host duties ( and I mean really perfomring duties) then no #4035

the camp host came running our, yelling, that is not acceptable (meaning, a tap of the horn). The clincher was, the truck belonged to someone who was visiting him. I can't believe he did not hear the knock on the door, or saw us sitting there. #4040

A campground for a select group of homesteaders and that special click #4143

many parks don't NEED a host, having a good host raises the quality of service #6722

Educating Military Campgrounds
The majority of MWR/MCG facilitators never see this "commercial" site so we're here for the camaraderie but constructive criticism might just be "blown in the wind"

but over 50% of the military campgrounds are aware of this website and are glad we're here.

"WITHOUT the benefit of extremely valuable input this site could provide them."

"House Armed Force Personnel Subcommittee on the state of Morale, Welfare, and Recreation (MWR} Interestingly no mention of RV parks but check the testimony on Golf Courses. This will also give you the identity of the MMFIC's from all services who oversee MWR "

CINC Installation Excellence Awards for MCG's

www.militarycampgrounds.us/index.php?opt...id=5826&catid=4#5826

www.militarycampgrounds.us/index.php?opt...id=5826&catid=4#5860

www.militarycampgrounds.us/index.php?opt...id=5826&catid=4#6265

www.militarycampgrounds.us/index.php?opt...id=5826&catid=4#6265


ICE: Interactive Customer Evaluation ( ice.disa.mil/ )
www.militarycampgrounds.us/community/for...mit=10&start=10#5401

Standands YES, but, oh my, CINC Installation Excellence Awards; be careful what you wish for. Can you imagine what will happen to MCGs if that were to become a point of interest? Let us consider the commander looking at carrier opportunities, based on pass/failure of some base-related inspection/award. If it were me, I would transfer the MCG to some civilian organization and let them be responsible for the outcome, as has just about everything else on our military installations – i.e. base/post/station housing, security, food service, etc! Guess what would happen? MCGs are typically located on some unused land area of the base (no rent), utilities are tied into the base utility grid (no utility costs), improvements to some extent are self-funded or if not, will have a return on investment. In other words, MCG rates are low for a reason. Most MCGs are viewed as "cash cows" by their respective organizations - income without huge expenditures of cash. Once a civilian organization takes over, business costs would, by necessity escalate. The current $10 - $20 per night rates would quickly look like the off-base KOA rates. Would we have a standardized MCG system, yes, but at what cost to you and I?

JMHO - John

I agree with the idea that prices would skyrocket if the MCG privatized -- happens every time. Look at the BX and what is now beginning to happen even in Commissary.

I'd rather take the chance that an interested base CO would upgrade the MCG, or just let some remain better than others. Once we start 'costing' this stuff out, and standardizing we'll be at $25/$30 as even some are now.

HU's are important, but not the reason I camp or RV - I do it for the travel ops ... and although the MCGs are often used as 'full-time' parks by some, makes sense to me that we try to continue as a short-term camp-over as best we can.

I agree with the notion of letting individual base commanders know how their campgrounds measure up using the ICE system. Beyond that I have 2 observations:

1. The different military branches cannot agree on base stickers, weapons, aircraft, uniforms, military courtesy procedures, PXs, commissaries, etc., etc, etc. Thinking they could or would want to standardize their MWR activities is dreaming. :silly:

2. I also agree that if they somehow did do that - the result may be worse than the problem. Be careful what you wish for...

For now patronize the good ones, avoid the bad ones, and let us know on Military Campgrounds forum which are which.

Joe